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Wiki /Raspbian: "Install Jessie 64bit" - Newbie Confused

Posted: Mon Dec 24, 2018 9:47 pm
by Michael Mulligan
Newbie here.

As I understand it, Raspbian is a 32-bit OS as supplied by the Foundation.

But this page: has as Prerequisite #1:
SD card created with raspbian Jessie 64bit.
In order of likelihood, the explanations of what I see as an issue are:
1. Newbie is dumber than a rock. He is confused about 32 vs. 64 bits. See Fermi quote at end.
2. The wiki's statement is incorrect.
3. One must build Raspbian in 64-bit mode. Seems unlikely and hard.

If anyone could tell me which explanation is correct, I'd appreciate it.

I want to install ZoneMinder on a Raspberry Pi 3 Model B+ in anticipation of the Pi 4 which I hope gets 2GB of RAM and USB 3.0 or better. I have all POE IP cameras. Before committing to using the Pi and ZoneMinder, I want to make sure it's at least possible. I realize memory and speed limits are going to limit what can be done with the 3B+.

I'm hoping Stretch is now a viable host.

Michael Mulligan
Before I came here I was confused about this subject. Having listened to your lecture I am still confused. But on a higher level. - Enrico Fermi

Re: Wiki /Raspbian: "Install Jessie 64bit" - Newbie Confused

Posted: Tue Dec 25, 2018 7:24 pm
by snake
You should be able to get ZM running on Raspbian Stretch 32 bit. I have done this. The wiki may be incorrect. Yes, as you mentioned, there are severe limitations with an RPI vs a traditional desktop/server. I wouldn't recommend it for anything more than SD or lower resolution of a limited number of cameras. I run an RPI in addition to my main server, as an adjunct. It watches two cameras from the 30. One is HD at 3FPS, the other is SD at about 5FPS. I'm forced to use record (not modect) on the cameras.

You might have better luck with a more powerful ARM board, if you want to go that route. The RPI is general purpose, but camera recording is demanding and you should use a higher end board for it. One recommendation for an ARM board is at the end of this post:

Re: Wiki /Raspbian: "Install Jessie 64bit" - Newbie Confused

Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2018 6:33 am
by Michael Mulligan

snake wrote:
Tue Dec 25, 2018 7:24 pm
The wiki may be incorrect.
If the Wiki is indeed wrong, what is the mechanism to get it changed? It might confuse others.

I will being installing ZM on the 3B+ with Stretch Lite + MariaDB + Apache2. I'll report on the results and document anything that seems noteworthy. It may be several weeks though.

As stated in the first post, doing this on the 3B+ is really an experiment. I want to make sure:
1. I can do it.
2. ZM works with my HD cameras (older Q-See models, mostly models QTN8039B). They are not on the HCL but are supposed to support ONVIF.

Assuming RPi + ZM works with one camera at some frame rate, I want to get an idea of how many RPis would be needed to support 16 cameras. The 3B+ is not realistic, but if the Pi 4 has true USB 3.0 + GigiBit Ethernet + >= 2 GB of RAM it might be enough to handle two to four cameras. In that case, four to eight RPis would handle all the cameras.
snake wrote:
Tue Dec 25, 2018 7:24 pm
You might have better luck with a more powerful ARM board, ...
If the Pi 4 does not meet all three requirements, I will indeed need look at other solutions. But I have a desire to stick with the Pi because the house has about eight other Pis (various models) for various functions - most importantly the Ethernet <-> Home Automation interface. Sticking with one variant of Linux is desirable for me as I have been away from the Unix/Linux world for years.

One reason to avoid a PC is that the house was wired with +5v and +12v in the physically secure location where the "recorders" will be located. I could get 110v there, but it would mean wall surgery - through concrete. :(


Re: Wiki /Raspbian: "Install Jessie 64bit" - Newbie Confused

Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2018 6:01 pm
by snake
I will take a look at the wiki article for Raspbian and update it. Anyone is welcome to make a wiki account, you need only send a message to one of the admins (take a look at the "website issues" forum here for more details). It had been locked down, because spam was a problem when anyone could create an account.

If you already have a few of the RPIs, then they may as well be used. I just would be wary of investing in RPIs for ZM. ARM doesn't perform as well as i386, in my experience (though I haven't used anything beyond an RPI or Beaglebone). That out of the way...

When installing ZM on stretch, you will have a choice of 1.30.4 and 1.32.2. Now, the Debian Repos only have 1.32.2 in experimental. Both are covered here (keeping in mind, the install guide is traditionally for i386/x86-64, though many steps are the same between i386 and ARM):

Code: Select all
The reason why I mention the two different versions, is that 1.32.2 has h264 passthrough which may offer some performance benefit over the previous version... However, if you are starting out, you may want to wait until 1.32.2 is in the stable repos.

I'll try to go through the Raspbian install steps (for rpi3) and cover both of these install scenarios. Then I'll add them to the existing Debian install steps list and raspbian page.

The thing about the RPI is that they are so common and inexpensive, people are going to use them. I will update the documentation.

Re: Wiki /Raspbian: "Install Jessie 64bit" - Newbie Confused

Posted: Mon Dec 31, 2018 7:28 am
by Michael Mulligan
Let us know with either a new topic in "Distributions" (preferred) or a reply to this topic when you have a new guide for us.
Thanks again, MM :D